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UK WTC (Whole truth coalition)
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kbo234
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick Meaney wrote:


no plane, beam weapons, the illuminati, yadda yadda yadda



I'm a 9/11 activist but do not feel overly concerned that some people who agree with me want to discuss these issues. Most 9/11 Truthers (including myself) will not go there......and the fact that MSM will use such ideas against the movement as a whole is, well, to be expected. Making a site where such things are not discussed will not make public acceptance any easier for you or the rest of us.

What this movement is asserting is OUTRAGEOUS ANYWAY.

It just so happens it is also true....(that 9/11 was an inside job). Once people get this, and I am amazed at how many people are on board now, then they understand that they are living within a matrix of deception and thinking about these issues is not as outrageous as you insist.

Most people who don't know about 9/11 are wised up by friends, family and associates rather than the likes of us.

It might be that we have done our most important work already and 9/11 truth will now continue to grow of its own accord. I have had 2 people I hardly know raise the subject with me over the past couple of weeks.

Blimey.

That was great.

What we need now is something to unite around and become really active about.
How this will happen, and it must, who can tell.

For myself, as a person of leftist sympathies, I am nervous of any political party or movement that accepts the pyramidal power structure....because where there is concentrated power, of the right or left, corruption and wickedness have always thrived. This is unlikely to change.

I'd like to see a party that promised to take back the power of money-creation from private banks, disband the central banks and then set about dismatling its own powers and returning them all (as much as is possible) to small local communities, that would decide just about everything for themselves.
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Mick Meaney
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 6:34 am    Post subject: Re: it's not intentional? Reply with quote

chrisc wrote:
Mick Meaney wrote:
I'm sure it's not intentional


I more-or-less totally agree with the rest of your post (regarding the UK anyhow) but why are you so sure that "it's not intentional"?

Hasn't this:

Mick Meaney wrote:
The attempt to tie in issues that are based in reality, truly need investigating / action and have a solid foundation...with... no plane, beam weapons, the illuminati... is only going to drag down the serious stuff and label the people who have been involved with these campaigns and issues as loons


Been going on for long enough to make it clear that it is intentional?


Who knows. I was going to give the UK ones the benefit of the doubt for the moment, not so much with Judy Woods and the American side of things. Maybe you are right, maybe it is intentional, after walking out of 9/11 truth meetings because the reptilian agenda and anti semitic theories were being pushed as fact, and making my opinions known about this, litte has changed since 2005 when I first became involved.

So maybe it is intentional, in fact the more I think about it, the more you've actually got a good point there as those pushing these theories must be fully aware of the damage they cause by now.

Note to anybody who wants to deny this has happened, I saved the minutes from every meeting which clearly documents the high levels of anti semitism among other things. Anybody who wants a copy can have one.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick, my friend, who are you now working for? I can't believe your last two posts. Are you accusing me of working for the 'dark agendas' - because my friend that is precisely what you have done.

I have nailed my colours firmly to the mast of Judy Wood. Why? Because there is physical evidence that cannot, IMHO, be explained by conventional science. Plus, I am extremely suspicious of Steven Jones and his background of trying to wreck Cold Fusion research and his close affiliation to the Mormon Church - a real focal point and vehicle for the NWO/Illuminati.

As for the 'Reptilians', again the evidence is overwhelmng that this is an area worthy of serious research. Listen to that wonderful man, Zulu Shaman Cedo Mutwa, look at the legends, oral traditions and histories of the indigenous peoples around the world and how often reptilian entities come into the picture. And look at cutting edge Quantum Physics which completely changes conventional 'taught in the school' science and turns it on its head. Mick, my friend, you are obviously afraid of going where the evidence takes you.

And what's this rubbish about 'Anti-Semitism'? Are you accusing me of this?

Now to the central part of your extremely strange outburst. The establishment of the Whole Truth Coalition for the UK is simply to provide a clearing house of information to bring people, campaigns and causes together to share common ground. Unlike yourself, we are prepared to pursue TRUTH WITHOUT FEAR.

Time is against all of us - the NWO/Illuminati/call them what you like, are getting ready for their big push to shut the cell door with all of us trapped on the inside. On all fronts (False Flag Terrorism, the undemocratic surge towards a EU Superstate, the assembly by stealth of a Police State, the man-made Global Warming scam, suppressed cures for ill health, electro-magnetic pollution, contrived global starvation and famines, chemtrails, corrupt banking systems that put people and countries into manufactured debt, suppressed 'free' energy sources etc etc) people are waking up and realising that all of this is part of a 'Big Picture'. The Whole Truth Coalition is simply a vehicle or tool to empower and unite fellow campaigners to become more effective.

On the political front, I stand by every word I wrote. The Left are both intellectually bankrupt and moribund. They have given us Blair and now Brown and the illegal wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. And the Tories are no better as events are engineered to give us Blair Mk2 in the shape of Cameron. The LibDems have lost the plot with their uncritical support of Europe and the Greens (I was in the Green Party from 1978 until 1992, serving for five years on Green Party Council) have signed up unwittingly to be pawns of the NWO and are now a part of the grand plan to rid the planet of 'useless eaters'. The only honest way forward is TRUTHSEEKING.

Sorry, Mick, but I am dumfounded by your outbursts. Is this the same man who helped David Icke with his website and who supported me generously everytime we met. What's happened? Don't you want to be at the cutting edge of finding out the truth? Are you now convinced I am working for the other side? And is RINF still at the cutting edge of finding out the truth about the human condition?

Best wishes as always

Justin

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick Meaney wrote:

no plane, beam weapons, the illuminati, yadda yadda yadda



There seems to be a little or even a lot of confusion in all of this. Firstly Mick, I see you are still advertising 3 DVD's I originally supplied to you on your Website:

http://www.rinf.com/infoshop/dvds.php

These are primarily compilations of other people's materials. However, one of them "What's going on on Mars" features one of my own presentations and, for example, examines the evidence for previous life on Mars, based on NASA data. Does this fall into the “yadda yadda yadda” category too?

Whole Truth Coalition will be focused primarily on 2 things:

1) Evidence
2) Packaging the evidence in ways which are accessible and understandable to people.

This is precisely how the only 2 current Qui Tam 9/11 court cases have been assembled - based on evidence. This assemblage has taken an awful lot of time and a modest amount of money and the evidence is now lodged in the court of the SDNY.

http://www.prlog.org/10056544.html

It's this type of thing that I would like to see be a focus for Whole Truth Coalition. In other words, people in it won't go around *asking* for a new independent investigation, they will *do* the investigation, publish results and then take what action they see fit.

The beauty is that people will be free to this through an association with WTC or completely outside of it.

Some of us realise that trying to understand and campaign about a single issue like 9/11 is actually more difficult as you have to force yourself *not* to talk about other related issues like energy and the fake reasons for climate change.



Tony Gosling tried to emphasize this point:

Quote:

Some people's 'truth' is not true at all is just plain wrong in an absolute sense.


He does not site particular evidence or a particular thing, so what I would say to him is this. If you ignore evidence, you will fail to find the truth. Deliberate and wilful ignorance of evidence is an action which is common both inside and outside the 9/11 “truth” movement and this was the theme of another referenced article I wrote here:

http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=7429


I might also remind readers of the reaction we received in January to our presentation of Hutchison Effect evidence in relation to 9/11:

“This is a revelation beyond revelations…this trumps everything…If this story ever gets out, it will change the course of the United States’ and the whole world’s history.”

The audio of this is worth listening too. It, to me, expresses the need for people to make sense of the *whole* picture, not just 9/11 and bits and pieces.

Our experience in getting the reaction to both posting evidence of the Hutchison Effect and 9/11 and that of also relating Weather Modification technology and 9/11 – in the shape of Hurricane Erin also connects more dots – but there are plenty of people who “won’t go there” even though the evidence continues to build – almost daily – to support these general conclusions.

Those who wish to ignore evidence are, of course, free to do so. But please bear in mind that this is exactly what the 9/11 commission did - and this is the main reason why they are now held in such low regard by more and more people.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:33 am    Post subject: Oh my... Reply with quote

Justin wrote:
I have nailed my colours firmly to the mast of Judy Wood...

As for the 'Reptilians', again the evidence is overwhelmng that this is an area worthy of serious research.


Uh-hu... Rolling Eyes

Andrew Johnson wrote:
I originally supplied to you on your Website:

http://www.rinf.com/infoshop/dvds.php

...one of them "What's going on on Mars" features one of my own presentations and, for example, examines the evidence for previous life on Mars, based on NASA data. Does this fall into the “yadda yadda yadda” category too?


Yes, I expect it does... Rolling Eyes

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:52 am    Post subject: Re: Oh my... Reply with quote

chrisc wrote:


Yes, I expect it does... Rolling Eyes


Well, what I would suggest is that you actually look at the evidence, then comment on aspects of it. Here is a sample:


Link



Link


This is NASA data. What do you think of NASA as whole ChrisC?

Here's some more data related to climate:


Link


Can you (or anyone) comment on specific points of data at all?

It is precisely this sort of data I will be posting and highlighting in efforts to uncover the truth., so if people can give me a qualified opinion on what the "correct" or most likely explanation is, I am waiting to hear it (none in the last few years have made any real sense).[/youtube]

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Justin
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChrisC wrote

Quote:
Justin wrote:
I have nailed my colours firmly to the mast of Judy Wood...

As for the 'Reptilians', again the evidence is overwhelmng that this is an area worthy of serious research.


Uh-hu...


Even by this Forum's standards, that is a pretty childish and pathetic response.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:41 am    Post subject: This fails as effective disinformation... Reply with quote

Andrew Johnson wrote:
Well, what I would suggest is that you actually look at the evidence, then comment on aspects of it.


Well, it's what I expected, some OK info -- of course there will be at least microbes on Mars -- mixed with absurd speculation about what has been found on Mars -- geodesic domes, weather balloons and a sphinx... Rolling Eyes

This fails as effective disinformation:

Peter Dale-Scott wrote:
"Disinformation, in order to be effective, must be 90% accurate."


It's more like 10 or 20% accurate... Rolling Eyes

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick,
Best of luck with whatever you decide to do in the future. I'm sorry to hear your local group has been taken over by anti-Semites and respect you for disasosiating yourself with them.

Justin,
Quote:
As for the 'Reptilians', again the evidence is overwhelmng that this is an area worthy of serious research. Listen to that wonderful man, Zulu Shaman Cedo Mutwa, look at the legends, oral traditions and histories of the indigenous peoples around the world and how often reptilian entities come into the picture.


An excerpt from my blog:

Quote:
A large part of the argument consists of a slide show of artefacts from past cultures and religions spanning the world which show images of dragons, serpents, reptiles and apparent reptile human hybrids. This doesn’t convince me at all. They may exist but to use them as evidence let alone proof of humanoid reptile creatures actually existing is flimsy. For a start the dragon, the serpent, and the reptoid mythical creatures seen on statues and engravings through history do not resemble each other convincingly and are tied together for convenience of the theory. At one point Icke even shows an African artefact that looks nothing like a reptile humanoid, but explains that this is because people in that culture were forbidden from making representations which resembled their reptoid masters (!). While it is true that by cherry-picking reptilian symbolism and imagery from past cultures and religions you can find a collection suitable enough to support this claim, the same process could just as easily feature any other type of creature.
Let's say birds, for the sake of argument.

In popular depictions of Abrahamic mythology angels are bird-human hybrids; In Greek mythology Aello is a bird-human hybrid employed by the Gods to make peace and carry out punishments for crimes while in the tragic myth of lovers Ceyx and Alcyone, Alcyone in her grief over Alcyone's death was transformed into a kingfisher; as she tried to drag the lifeless body of Ceyx to shore, he too changed into a bird.; In Egyptian mythology we have bird men and women at every turn - the soul of a person, or their 'Ba' was represented as a soul and Theba was a man-headed hawk, for example; In Persian mythology The bird Camros perches in the top of the tree of life; a recurring mythological creature through several religions and cultures is the Griffin - a bird with the body of a lion, as was the Hyppogryth - a bird with the body of a horse; then there's the Pheonix in Arabic and Egyptian myth, who self combusts and then resurrects on an endless cycle; Note the Thunder Bird of Native American mythology and beware the giant man eating Poukai bird-god from Polynesian mythology, and while you're at it keep an eye out for the dastardly Sirens, the enormous elephant eating Roc of Arabian lore, Bagucks in Chippewa mythology, Bar Juchne in Talmud, Camulatz in Maya mythology, Chamrosh in Persian mythology, The Cu Bird in Mexican folklore, Feng-huang the Chinese Phoenix and Quetzalcoatl in Aztec mythology.

I could go on and I could have picked almost any animal and done a quick Google search to the same effect. Mythical creatures which are a hybrid of man and beast are rife throughout the litany of cultures which have spanned the globe over the centuries. Take your pick of reptiles, birds, elephants or monkeys and you'll be able to find enough engravings, stories and statues to equal the reptoid count.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I saved the minutes from every meeting which clearly documents the high levels of anti semitism among other things


Mick could you posiibly clarify your statement by informing us which meetings you are refering to and copy and paste the relevant minutes here.

Good luck with your plausible activism

Peace & truth

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stefan, we shall just have to agree to disagree. My own experience of talking to aborigine elders in Australia and North America leaves me in no doubt because they all talked about reptilian entities coming into their ancestors' lives and affecting their nations.

http://www.reptilianagenda.com/myth/m110199a.shtml

Yes, other living creatures are also used in their imagery to describe legends and great stories but I find the testimony of Credo Mutwa is extremely compelling and if you haven't, I would urge you to listen carefully to what he has to say about his ancestors. And modern day eyewitness accounts of 'shapeshifting' cannot be dismissed out of hand, especially when you take into account what the quantum physicists are finding out. Let's all keep an open mind on this subject.

As regards this.....

Quote:
I'm sorry to hear your local group has been taken over by anti-Semites and respect you for disasosiating yourself with them.


....I'm dumfounded. I just hope Mick can justify this appalling slur. And he can start with me as I belong to this group of truthseekers. Mick, am I anti-semitic?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Justin wrote:
Stefan, we shall just have to agree to disagree. My own experience of talking to aborigine elders in Australia and North America leaves me in no doubt because they all talked about reptilian entities coming into their ancestors' lives and affecting their nations.

http://www.reptilianagenda.com/myth/m110199a.shtml


I'm always happy to agree to disagree, as I said at the end of that piece, I don't find anything threatening about there being a multitude of viewpoints on the world around - it's one of the things that makes the human race so wonderful.

Quote:
Yes, other living creatures are also used in their imagery to describe legends and great stories but I find the testimony of Credo Mutwa is extremely compelling and if you haven't, I would urge you to listen carefully to what he has to say about his ancestors. And modern day eyewitness accounts of 'shapeshifting' cannot be dismissed out of hand, especially when you take into account what the quantum physicists are finding out. Let's all keep an open mind on this subject.


My is open to all possibilities, but in the failure to find any credible evidence I can't accept this.

I'm sure aborigal's speak of visits from lizard creatures - there are a lots of lizards in South East Asia and Austalia. I'm sure Native Americans have lots of myths about birds and bears and wolves - there being a lot of those in the Americas. I have no doubt the myth of the minatour from Greece could not have occurred without there being a few bulls in the area.

Human-Beast hybrids are common in human mythology because of the way the human mind works - rather than being truly creative we creatively merge existing concepts. Ask a child to draw a monster and every time it will be a combination of different animal and human parts - so it goes.

Quantum physics can be used to shore up a lot of fantastical ideas, especially as no one really understands it - even quantum physicists!

Quote:
As regards this.....

Quote:
I'm sorry to hear your local group has been taken over by anti-Semites and respect you for disasosiating yourself with them.


....I'm dumfounded. I just hope Mick can justify this appalling slur. And he can start with me as I belong to this group of truthseekers. Mick, am I anti-semitic?


I didn't hear Mick call you anti-Semitic.

Anti-Semitism exists. Can we agree on this?

It is not unique to the truth movement and ad hominem attemepts to fuse the two are just that. If 9/11 was an inside job, then as more people realise this a proportion of them will be anti-Semitic, because a proportion of society are anti-Semitic, just like a proportion are racist, a proportion sexist and a proportion homophobic. Anti-Semites think apples are fruits as well - it doesn't mean everyone who thinks an apple is a fruit is anti-Semitic.

The challenge we have, as do all left-wing groups, all enivornmental groups and all groups of any kind, is to single out and exclude those people who have unacceptable and disgusting predjudices. Just because someone shares our opinion on 9/11 does not mean they like-minded, as our claims about 9/11 are as factual as an apple being a fruit. We should end the idea of an open door policy to anyone who knows these facts as we are and should always be a PEACE MOVEMENT first and a TRUTH MOVEMENT second.

It's a shame Mick felt that he had become a minority from his circle and had to exclude himself...

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the greatest respect Stefan it's up to Mick to answer, not yourself. If this group he refers to is the one I go to, then I've never heard one anti-semitic remark in all the time I've been going. Yes, we question Zionism, as most Truthseekers do, but we never ever make fun of or belittle Judaism or the Jewish people. Like Pikey, I await to hear what Mick has to say. If it is our group, I'm not aware of any minutes being taken except by Penny in the early days.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There really is no point in debating this, some of the comments above and the emails I'm receiving which state that I'm 'working for a dark agenda' have reinforced my opinion that conclusions are reached willy-nilly with little respect for the truth and often filled with speculation and paranoia.

The lines between friendship and the ability to look and debate on an issue objectively have been blurred to the point where; when someone disagrees with you, it is taken as though they have launched an attack on you personally and not your political views. This is cultish.

I'm not entering into a debate here because I've seen it all before and seen how people who disagree with you are treated. The accusations which are made against them and the names they are called. I fully expected to receive the same treatment.

We've had people walking out of events because of what they call anti semitic material, I happen to agree with them.

Here Steve, you asked me to make it public here so let it be on your head when the Watch sites repost it and discredit your cause further.

Quote:
Present :-

Justin, Paul, David and Wanda, Edward, Maureen, Penny, Jayne, Ash, Mick, Laurie, Steve, Alf.

The chair was offered to anyone in the group who wanted to have a go and as no-one was forthcoming, Justin suggested that three people presented specific reports before the meeting was opened up for discussion and any other business.

Penny suggested that introductions would be helpful as some new members were present.

Justin spoke about 'Stop the War Coalition' and their forthcoming demo. in London and asked if anyone could be present.

Then he spoke of his millionaire friend 'Jimmy Walter' who had agreed to fund an advert re 9/11which Justin was excited about and was in the process of re-vamping for the Westmoreland Gazette. As he was working for the newspaper and was 'Golden Boy (not balls) at that moment in time, there was a firm possibility that the advert would be put in. This was unpredented as Wessy Gazette was owned by Newsquest who is controlled by the 'dark powers!'

Justin also said that he would be writing to all M.P's re 9/11 Truth Group. He would invite them to research this important issue for themselves.

David Boyle spoke next. He described the delays etc. in putting his exhibition together in Blackpool. He hoped to be open for Easter - even if only one film was running. He described the large sign showing Bush and his wife which will go up on the day of the opening and extended an invitation to us all to be present at the opening in order to support him and hand out leaflets etc.

He spoke of plans to advertise the 'Conspiracies Exhibition' far and wide and was preparing a full article which would be sent to the media. He said that this was the 'opportunity to hit big!'
He needed help with the videos he wanted to make himself re UFO's/ancient monuments and Alf was asked to help.

David also spoke of the gulag camps in the States and special trains with handcuffs which had been created for future use. He described how our safety was paramount and a suggestion was put forward for us to become a new political party for our security.

This was not taken forward as there was some opposition.
David finished up with asking us all for practical help with his exhibition as the work load was formidable.

Alf spoke of his web site 'flamesong' and asked us all to register now and use the forum. Send a personal message to Alf to ask for admission to the forum.
He suggested we check out the footage of the 9/11 event at www.letsroll.org

Mick spoke about his web site (RINF) and some members were very complementary as they were familiar with it.

Ash spoke of his involvement with the youth and music scene and how much support he could achieve with this section of society. David endorsed what he said and added that most of the young people who attended the music events were very spiritually aware and knew just what was going on politically as well.

Justin spoke about the political party conferences this Autumn and suggested we find out where they are meeting. Also, could we have a celebrity endorsement like Chris Ewbank??

Paul suggested John Pilger, as he could be very helpful. He also spoke of 'Dave Starbuck' material and referred to the articles in the magazine 'Nexus' which showed, for example 6 million Jews killed in the holocaust as eing untrue figures.

Justin showed us some information re 'Zionists'. He spoke about the Illuminati aiming to reduce the population of the planet to 2 billion. O2 levels were going down and NcDonald Douglas had built a huge, secret underground cavern in the Nevada Desert!

Paul said that the editor of the Times was prepared to publish some time ago and he was murdered!!

Justin finished up by saying that we must 'hit on all fronts!!' He quoted the film 'El Cid.'

Penny mentioned the channelled book by Barbara Marciniak called 'Family of Light' which had many references to the Illuminati.

The meeting wound up and action points were discussed.

Penny offered to update the members contact list and we all decided to help David when we could. We said that we would contact each other and keep members informed.


This was an early meeting and the first one I attended. I didn't return to the group for some time after that meeting but it is interesting to note the amount of members fell dramatically to around 4.

Fact is, I have to get my opinions off my chest publicly, it's the only way you'll be heard in this movement. I don't expect anyone to agree with me and fully expect to be labelled as an agent, shill or mole. That's already happened to some degree, in less than 24 hours. Is that a new record?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick Meaney said:
Quote:
Fact is, I have to get my opinions off my chest publicly, it's the only way you'll be heard in this movement. I don't expect anyone to agree with me and fully expect to be labelled as an agent, shill or mole. That's already happened to some degree, in less than 24 hours. Is that a new record?


Mick,

You trawl up a meeting that happened three years ago with minutes taken by Penny; you make your pronouncements in public without having given any inclination to your supposed friends that you were unhappy with things and what was being discussed at meetings; you make outrageous insinuations about our group being anti-semitic with no evidence at all to back this up (and we are still waiting for the evidence); you are doing all this at a time when we are trying to launch a worthwhile initiative to evaluate evidence so as to get at the truth whilst at the same time bringing people and diverse campaigns together in a spirit of goodwill; and you have worked with David Icke and never to my knowledge have you expressed serious doubts about his research or his findings. Forgive me Mick, but I find your behaviour and logic very strange to say the least, especially as you always greeted me in an extremely friendly and supportive way with no evidence at all you disagreed with the basic themes that the Whole Truth Coalition are exploring now.

What gives? Something doesn't add up here.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The minutes I posted are 3 years old but very little has changed in that time.

I have walked out of meetings in protest, made my feelings known via email, on the phone and in person for the last 3 years. Whether or not I had been listened to is clear. Steve asked for evidence, he got it. If you want deny any of this that's fine with me.

Holocaust denial sounds pretty anti-semitic to me.
A Jewish conspiracy to rule the world sounds pretty anti-semitic to me.
'The Protocols of the Elders of Zion' sound pretty anti-semitic to me.

I've had enough and this new initiative is attempting to combine issues that should never be associated with each other, it's too far.

Also Justin, in one of your emails today, which you sent to others behind my back (very underhanded imo), you stated:
Quote:
Six months ago I was attacked by Mick's partner (she wrote a letter to Annie and Ian) for mentioning privately to someone at a public meeting about David Icke and his reptilian research - she complained it was not on for a Co-Chair to be mentioning such things, even in a private conversation.

This is twisting the facts. I was at the meeting - I infact walked out after shaking my head at you and mouthing 'No' several times when you stated to the entire room that the world was controlled by shape shifting reptiles. It was not a private conversation, it was in front of many people. We were all sat in a circle and you were talking to a group of around 20 people. I'm sorry Justin, these are the facts. Louise who managed to stayed in the room slightly longer than I could, sent an email to yourself, Annie and Ian to make her objection known. I believe she only received a reply from yourself suggesting she investigate the reptilian agenda. Believe me, I have no problem with personal belief, but not when it is presented as the view of the British 9/11 Truth Campaign or any other campaign / movement I am involved in.

I will not be called a liar on here, spread it all over the internet if it makes you happy, but when it's directly in my face on a forum that I belong to, I will defend myself.

Btw, someone who is very near and dear to me and who has studied cults at degree level today told me the behaviour on this thread and in the emails show similarities to that of a cult when they lose a member.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick Meaney wrote:

Btw, someone who is very near and dear to me and who has studied cults at degree level today told me the behaviour on this thread and in the emails show similarities to that of a cult when they lose a member.


Your a bit of a cult yourself, aren't you, the way you talk about your old friends?

If I were them I wouldn't want any more to do with you.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kbo234 wrote:
Mick Meaney wrote:

Btw, someone who is very near and dear to me and who has studied cults at degree level today told me the behaviour on this thread and in the emails show similarities to that of a cult when they lose a member.


Your a bit of a cult yourself, aren't you, the way you talk about your old friends?

If I were them I wouldn't want any more to do with you.


Can't really see the cult connection there, besides everything I'm saying is the complete truth. I have actually made some really good friends in the movement, who I will remain in contact with. Those who lack professionalism and rationality however, I will not.

Anyway who is in this to make friends? It's political.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:38 pm    Post subject: 9/11 truth and cults Reply with quote

Mick Meaney wrote:
Btw, someone who is very near and dear to me and who has studied cults at degree level today told me the behaviour on this thread and in the emails show similarities to that of a cult when they lose a member.


I can see that, to a degree, and I have no time what so ever for the reptile nonsense and jewish conspiracy theories etc however the only 9/11 truth related group I have found that I would actually describe as a cult is Laura Knight Jadczyk's Cassiopaea Cult -- this is a real cult... Rolling Eyes

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:44 pm    Post subject: Re: 9/11 truth and cults Reply with quote

chrisc wrote:
Mick Meaney wrote:
Btw, someone who is very near and dear to me and who has studied cults at degree level today told me the behaviour on this thread and in the emails show similarities to that of a cult when they lose a member.


I can see that, to a degree, and I have no time what so ever for the reptile nonsense and jewish conspiracy theories etc however the only 9/11 truth related group I have found that I would actually describe as a cult is Laura Knight Jadczyk's Cassiopaea Cult -- this is a real cult... Rolling Eyes

Eeek. That person has tried to publish her ramblings on my site a few times. Any site that allows Lisa Guliani to roam free is highly suspect imo.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick Meaney wrote:

Can't really see the cult connection there.....


You're obviously the kind of guy who misses quite a lot. Are you sure political activism is right for you?

You also appear to be happy to throw around abuse and criticise people for holding views without engaging with the evidence on which their views are based.

It is difficult to respect that.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick Meaney wrote
Quote:
The minutes I posted are 3 years old but very little has changed in that time.

I have walked out of meetings in protest, made my feelings known via email, on the phone and in person for the last 3 years. Whether or not I had been listened to is clear. Steve asked for evidence, he got it. If you want deny any of this that's fine with me.

Holocaust denial sounds pretty anti-semitic to me.
A Jewish conspiracy to rule the world sounds pretty anti-semitic to me.
'The Protocols of the Elders of Zion' sound pretty anti-semitic to me.

I've had enough and this new initiative is attempting to combine issues that should never be associated with each other, it's too far.


Never once in the three years I've known you have you EVER expressed your doubts to me whether in person, verbally on the phone or through an email. The only times I have seen you go out of a meeting is to have a smoke or get a drink.....and you have always come back. And what's all this garbage about anti-semitism. Yes, we've talked about the wrongdoings of Zionism but we have ALWAYS distinguished between Judaism and the Jewish Faith and the political goings on of Israel and Israel's backers. Remember, I've always gone out of my way to highlight the Orthodox Jewish organisations who oppose Zionism - it's clear from this ridiculous posting from yourself that you either know very little about this subject (which I find hard to believe) or you are tarnishing us with this anti-semitic slur for a reason. And if you cannot see why the different issues of 9/11 and False Flag Terrorism, the ongoing advance of the EU Superstate, the man-made global warming scam, electromagnetic pollution, chemtrails, the banking scams that are putting individuals and nations into debt and the suppression of safe medical cures are not related, then I wonder about your RINF site and its effectiveness. Are you seriously telling me Mick that these issue are not related?

Quote:
This is twisting the facts. I was at the meeting - I infact walked out after shaking my head at you and mouthing 'No' several times when you stated to the entire room that the world was controlled by shape shifting reptiles. It was not a private conversation, it was in front of many people. We were all sat in a circle and you were talking to a group of around 20 people. I'm sorry Justin, these are the facts. Louise who managed to stayed in the room slightly longer than I could, sent an email to yourself, Annie and Ian to make her objection known. I believe she only received a reply from yourself suggesting she investigate the reptilian agenda. Believe me, I have no problem with personal belief, but not when it is presented as the view of the British 9/11 Truth Campaign or any other campaign / movement I am involved in.

I will not be called a liar on here, spread it all over the internet if it makes you happy, but when it's directly in my face on a forum that I belong to, I will defend myself.

Btw, someone who is very near and dear to me and who has studied cults at degree level today told me the behaviour on this thread and in the emails show similarities to that of a cult when they lose a member.


From what I remembered about the evening in question. I was discussing the reptilian aspect of David's work whilst I was standing at the bar talking to some open minded truthseekers who had travelled some way to get to the meeting. I certainly didn't see you mouthing anything at me when I was doing my opening introduction at this NW Truthseekers meeting (not a British 9/11 Truth Campaign meeting please note) and, if anything, I do remember getting warm applause from the audience so they must have liked something I had said.

And what's all this rubbish about 'Cults' and 'losing a member'?

So, in this one thread you have managed to slur this new initiative, (which it is hoped will help get the truth out in the UK in a more effective way so that we can defeat the NWO/Illuiminati non-violently by exposing their gameplan to the British people) by accusing us in a roundabout way of being anti-semitic and a cult. Not bad for one day's work Mick? So what are you trying to achieve? And perhaps if I was less charitable, who are you really working for?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't drive and depended on others for transport, I don't expect them to leave with me but I have no choice but to return at the end of meetings if I want to make it home that night.

This is just becoming pointless now and I don't see any use in continuing going back and forth.

So instead I'll leave you to ponder this; when I split away from the Cumbria group and formed the Lancaster group we had the involvement / support of pro active groups such as NO2ID and the Stop the War Coalition, we had journalists regularly attending and reporting positively on events, we had the support of teachers, lawers, health care professionals, students and people from all walks of life who had never encountered the information we were presenting but returned on a regular basis bringing their friends and family along.

Now look again at your methods and ask me again who I am working for.

Also it's been pointed out to me that you think that when I speak about anti-semitism I'm referring to you alone. Justin, I am not. The problem is a whole lot bigger than what gets said at Cumbria meetings.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Justin wrote:
Not bad for one day's work Mick? So what are you trying to achieve? And perhaps if I was less charitable, who are you really working for?


Justin this is out of order
Mick's expressed his serious disquiet about some important stuff.
He's raised some points you should address, preferably privately, not wriggle out by accusing him of working for the other side.


Don't worry Mick,
You're not alone m8

This is the sort of kookie stuff which makes great speculation but has no resonance for ordinary people.

Whilst I have seen some evidence that the protocols may be genuine there is a lot, lot more that they aren't. eg. The fact that Hitler used them to whip up such a violent hate campaign against the Jews entirely taints them ... and no matter what you do you will always be seen as the person waving the same document in the faces of the Jewish peope as Hitler did, which may well be a forgery, what great company you keep.

Anyway, we have some of the original writings of the Illuminati which were leaked back in the eighteenth century so why would we want to even bother with the protocols?

It does frustrate me when people set themselves up to be torn down, David Shayler style.

However misguided we might feel some of this initiative to be we must back them though - we're all into freedom of expression and association aren't we? Yes even for Mr Shayler and his 'Messianic Revolutionary Front.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not used to posting any comments on this forum, but as there is mention of a 9/11 Truth Group meeting held three years ago when I took the minutes and several things seem to have been misunderstood along with other views and opinions of various members of that same group, I feel it is now time to set some records straight.

Having taught in a big comprehensive school for 27 years, I am aware that no two people view the same situation in an identical way. In other words we see the world not as it is, but as we are.

So, although I have slept a few times since those early meetings, I have to say that I am struggling to piece together several of Mick Meaney's comments which have resulted in mouths of other members of our little group dropping open as mine did, when I read the posts.

Never have any of our core group group members leaned even slightly towards the description of 'Anti-semitic.!' What a preposterous idea and that is one avenue which I am shirking at the prospect of even discussing as it is a sheer waste of time!

The Cumbria (or then Kirkby Lonsdale) 9/11 Truth Group started as a group of like minded people who were happy to share ideas, research, DVDs, etc. etc. and also to offer genuine help when needed. Justin offered us lifts to London to take part in Stop the War marches and Pikey, Maureen and I spent hours helping David Boyle get his new exhibition site ready for opening. (To name just two instances.... There have been others..)

We have never been any thing else but a friendly group of kind hearted people who have really enjoyed embarking on one of the biggest learning curves of our lives and who have been more than willing to communicate that new knowledge to as many people as we could.

We were able to offer hands on help in Manchester in 2005 when Jimmy Walter facilitated the very first 9/11 conference with many speakers including David Shayler and Willy Rodriquez. What an event that was!

We have confronted our MP as a group on more than one occasion and also hosted William Rodriquez last year when 200 people almost filled the Victoria Hall here in sleepy old Grange-Over-Sands.
What a success story!

It is very sad to read the descriptions that Mick has put on this forum and I cannot for the life of me understand why he is taking this stance, when we are all trying to do the same thing and help people wake up to the truth - that we have been mind controlled and manipulated for centuries - even thousands of years by an unseen group of beings, who call themselves the 'Global Elite.'

We all have reptilian DNA in our bodies as we have definitely been genetically engineeered many, many years ago and my dowsing reveals that this is a low percentage for most of us - around 10% unless you happen to be a member of the thirteen family blood lines who rule in the shadows, or indeed a member of the royal family or aristocrcy. Then, the reptilian DNA can reach 90%, which is a sobering thought. We have a reptilian part of our brain and that cannot be denied.

Sorry if this offends anyone, but I go along with Justin and Ickey and Michael Tsarion and of course David Boyle - but I had not even read one of David Icke's books when our meetings first started, so my personal leanring curve has been really huge.

Now to bring things up to date a little. It is news to me Mick that you walked out of our meetings. I thought you went out to have a fag and you always came back!!

Also, I seem to remember helping you out when you organised events in Lancaster and never remember any discordant feelings towards our little group at all.

I can't remember e-mails coming from you to disagree with our core beliefs, except a lot of stuff about the first part of 'Zeitgeist.'
Anyway 'Ring of Power' is a better film....

In fact I do remember that you always put any events we organised on your web site, which was a great help and much appreciated.

Personally I agree with Andrew Johnson, Belinda, Dr. Judy Wood and John Hutchison in that secret, advanced weapon technology was used to disintegrate the tons of concrete from the twin towers to dust and this weapon used Zero Point Energy. Check the evidence (Andrew's site tells all) and it is impossible to refute what is actually recorded on film.

Mick mentions Justin telling everyone at our first Truthseekers (NW) meeting about his belief in the reptilian agenda and I can't remember that at all. He did talk privately about the reptilian hybrids to a friend of mine who stood by the bar and I listened and agreed with him. This was a private conversation and we didn't know that Mick's girlfriend was listening in. She wrote a very strange impersonal letter of complaint directly to Ian Crane who was chairman at that time and we had a job believing that she could actually do that.

She did send a copy to Justin, so he was able to respond, so on reflection there have been some disagreements in the past which can easily happen within any group. But I honestly thought that was sorted out.

If there is one saying that I have learned since living up here in the NW and often use when describing a strange situation involving people it is this one :- "There's nowt as queer as folks."

So Mick - sorry to disagree with you, but we are not and never have been anything like a 'cult...!!

You haven't been to our two Truthseeker gatherings we have arranged so far and so are not really in the picture as to how we are widening our horizons to 'be the change we want to see in the world.'

Our gatherings are platforms which give like minded people the opportunity to share ideas, inventions, therapies etc. under the loose description of 'SELF-EMPOWERMENT, SELF HEALING AND ALTERNATIVE ENERGY.' There has been a deliberate emphasis on the above themes instead of just concentrating on 9/11, as most of us believe that what you concentrate on, you actually empower with your own energy.

The last thing we want to do is to disempower ourselves and give all that lovely energy away to the 'Powers that Were.'

9/11 Truth Movement has been the catalyst and the means whereby like minded people have had the opportunity to come together and share so much. We will always be grateful for this and acknowledge the place it has had in our lives.

All power to your elbows as you are all great people who deserve the best in life. We all deserve spanking, sparkling good health, oodles of energy and masses of good humour. I am afraid that picking over the past and contradicting/criticising valued group memebers is not where I am coming from at all. So I will finish with the following statement:-

Belinda, Justin and Andrew's new initiative - 'The Whole Truth Coalition' is right up my street and I give it my full support. In fact I handed out hundreds of A5 fliers outside Brixton Academy on May 24th. before Ickey's presentation.

So let's all move on and be positive as we are all trying to achieve the same thing and that is freedom of the body and mind where love and compassion rule OK.

From Penny (Grange-Over-Sands.)

PS I am a pendulum dowser and can find out anything in any time line. I can predict that by the end of 2010, much of 9/11 truth and other conspiracy facts will be out in the open any way.

Truth is on the march and nothing will stop it.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyway and what the f*ck. Everone who has contributed to this thread is a lovely and genuine person. I think I've met and appreciated them all, apart from kbo whom I don't doubt at all,I can picture everyone of them in my minds eye and know what they've given me in terms of personal growth. So what's all the squabbling about?
It doesn't make the slightest bit of sense
possibly truthseekers are being scrambled in advance of very limited exposure of truth
We need to be very united at this time
Factionalism always happens at their behest.This is the usual trap. It's bollox as usual

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

peacepals wrote:
Never have any of our core group group members leaned even slightly towards the description of 'Anti-semitic.!' What a preposterous idea and that is one avenue which I am shirking at the prospect of even discussing as it is a sheer waste of time!


Shame I had always thought you were honest Pen.

You know there is racism in the group and if you want to admit it or not is fine either way with me, we both know the truth.

I fully expect the remaining group to sit in a circle at the next meeting, taking turns at creating a great conspiracy theory about me, like you have with other members who left in protest. I'm not interested in getting personal and hope that instead of wasting your time trying to find invisible boogeymen, you look at the validity of the information you're disseminating because you're ignoring the vast amount of war crimes, crimes against humanity, poverty, slavery, loss of liberties etc etc

None of which constitutes as conspiracy theories yet have a very real detrimental and long term effect on innocent people - but can also be stopped, your conspiracies only serve to hide these real problems.

Btw, probably one of my last questions to truthers; if you can create your own reality, as you claim, why on earth would you create one which is controlled by an evil Illuminati?

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mick,

So it's 'racism' now is it? I continue to be appalled by your slur that our group have displayed any anti-semitic views or feelings during our meetings. You said you had all the minutes to our meetings which prove this - well, paste them up and let's see.

Please look at this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dSHl3C9kgY&feature=related

By us condemning Zionism you are accusing me and the group of anti-semitism.....I reaally thought you were better informed.

Quote:
I'm not interested in getting personal and hope that instead of wasting your time trying to find invisible boogeymen, you look at the validity of the information you're disseminating because you're ignoring the vast amount of war crimes, crimes against humanity, poverty, slavery, loss of liberties etc etc


Just what are you attempting to achieve? It was you who launched a completely unprovoked 'personal' attack against us, accusing our group of anti-semitism. And what's all this about ignoring warcrimes, poverty, slavery etc etc? The whole reason for our existence is to get the truth out and so end all of this.

Quote:
Btw, probably one of my last questions to truthers


So you're not a Truther now - does this explain the lies against us?

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Justin, on more than one occasion it's been said "the Jews control everything" type bs, granted neither you or Steve have ever said that but you cannot deny that it's tolerated.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do deny it - it is certainly not tolerated.

You are now diluting your position - you said our group were anti-semitic, so let's see the evidence.

Quote:
Note to anybody who wants to deny this has happened, I saved the minutes from every meeting which clearly documents the high levels of anti semitism among other things. Anybody who wants a copy can have one.


Well, come on - let's see all these minutes you've saved and let's see the level of anti-semitism in our group that you claim exists.

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